BodyBuilding  

Go Back   BodyBuilding > The Supplement Area > Supplements

Supplements

Discuss anything about supplements


» Site Navigation
 > Shop
» Online Users: 28
3 members and 25 guests
1quick1, Cam_NZ, Cooter
Most users ever online was 638, 11-01-2006 at 09:20 AM.
» Current Poll
What is your Raw 1 rep max bench?
100+ - 18.88%
27 Votes
150+ - 16.78%
24 Votes
200+ - 23.08%
33 Votes
250+ - 13.99%
20 Votes
300+ - 10.49%
15 Votes
350+ - 4.90%
7 Votes
400+ - 2.80%
4 Votes
450+ - 2.80%
4 Votes
500+ - 2.10%
3 Votes
More than any man alive!!!!!!! - 4.20%
6 Votes
Total Votes: 143
You may not vote on this poll.
» Stats
Members: 3,119
Threads: 5,334
Posts: 73,979
Top Poster: 1quick1 (7,992)
Welcome to our newest member, ghij889
» Fitness Shop
If you register for free, you will be able to post threads, vote on polls and lots more. If you have problems with the registration or logging in, please contact the administrator.

Reply
 
LinkBack (8) Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 11-01-2006, 05:01 PM   8 links from elsewhere to this Post. Click to view. Protein.... form and function Post #1
 
BiggerThnU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Planet Earth,Western hemisphere
Age: 44
Posts: 180
Rep Power: 932
BiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond repute
As threatened the science side of protein. I might have to do this in parts… 1,2,3 etc depending how this goes. I think it is important that you understand the supplements you take and how they interact with body systems. Protein is a big one, and almost all of us take it wither we actually need it or not. Protein is the body's major building material, it is the quintessential nutrient because like oxygen it is essential to every cell in your body for metabolic activities. It is second only to water in over all abundance in the body. Protein comes from the Greek word "proteios" which means "of prime importance”. Everything from the brain to your finger nails are mostly made of protein. Antibodies that fight off disease are constructed of proteins as are every enzyme and many of the hormones that regulate your bodies biochemical activities. AS scientists unravel the role of protein in building maintaining and healing the body, various food fads, misunderstandings and dangerous ideas have also evolved. The high protein diet comes readily to mind for me. If total caloric needs are met, you really only need about 10 to 15 % of daily calories to be protein. The RDA recommends .8 grams per kilo (2.2 pounds) of body weight and this has a safety factor of 100% built into it! A person seeking to untangle the web of misinformation and confusion about the roll of protein in the diet must begin by understanding what protein is and how it works in our body.

So, what is protein?

Proteins are organic substances like fats and carbohydrates but unlike fats and carbs which are just a carbon base with oxygen and hydrogen attached, proteins have a essential addition : nitrogen. This makes them unique.(Yes some proteins have other minerals attached to them too like phosphorus or iron, but thats getting too deep.) Onward. Each protein molecule is made up of smaller units called amino acids, a word we are all familiar with as weight lifters. Twenty different amino acids are found in our body proteins. Nine of these are essential and must be gotten from diet, eleven can be made by the body through modification of the side chain. Each amino acid has 2 identifying structural features, an amino group (-NH2) this is the chemical part containing nitrogen and the acid group(-COOH). Peptides, which are chemical links, join amino acids together in long chains to form protiens. Think of a train and its cars, as the box cars are coupled and uncoupled new trains are made, so can amino acids to form proteins.Some of the 50,000 plus proteins the body needs are composed of sometimes hundreds of amino acids(think long train) others will contain only a few(a short train).

WE must look at the number and sequence of amino acids in a protein to determine function and character of that protein. The sequence is predetermined by the DNA, your personal genetic "blueprint" for the building of your proteins, controlling both the pattern and frequency of the appearance of amino acids. This genetic code is individual and unique to each person within our species.To complicate things further there is the cross linking of sulfur and hydrogen atoms between side chains of the amino acids. Amino chains can also fold or intertwine adding yet one more level of complexity, what it comes down to is each protein is tailor-made for its specific body function for your specific body.


Next "The roles of protein in our body’s" Hopefully soon.

The roles of protein in our body's.

Protein supply the body with the amino acids it needs to perform the innumerable activities of daily life, one of the most essential and important to us weightlifters: tissue growth and maintenance. Sufficient protein is essential for everything from height to weight increase in children and teens( like lots of you) to healing wounds, to constantly growing hair, the list is almost endless. Amino acids are used to replace and maintain tissue such as blood, skin, organs, connective tissue and muscle which are forever being degraded and regrown in a process called “protein turnover”. A 150 pound man will breakdown and synthesize 400 grams of protein! This equates to about 4x as much protein turnover as compared to the average American diet takes in. This is possible because most amino acids are freed during the course of protein breakdown and then are reused to build new proteins. Protein recycling is very efficient, but we still must replace lost proteins daily through diet for the body to work at 100%.

On top of this job, amino acids are needed in smaller amounts to make some of the hormones and all the enzymes that regulate body processes. A simple common example would be the hormone insulin, a protein that regulates the level of glucose in the blood. Enzymes basically are proteins that direct and speed up the thousands of chemical reactions that take place in the human body all the time. Enzymes break down fat, carbs and protein during digestion and rebuild new substances from the raw material our diet supplies. Each enzyme is specialized to a single job and without that enzyme a “enzyme dependent reaction” will not happen. Proteins are also a exacting part of the disease fighting immune system, after all antibodies are proteins. Because proteins can be manufactured with a precision fitted to a single use or purpose ,the body can produce using the 20 amino acids, a specific antibody for each foreign substance that enters our body. However when protein supplies are low, antibody production is depressed and we become vulnerable to infection and disease.

Protein also transport nutrients and molecules. Some transport proteins move substances in the blood, a good example is hemoglobin, a iron bearing protein containing 300 amino acids, moves oxygen from the lungs to all parts of the body. Protein complexes called “lipoproteins” allow fat and lipids to be carried in liquid blood. Protein also plays a big role in water balance in the body, proteins are too big to pass through semi-permeable membranes of blood vessels so they create something called osmotic pressure, this shifts water towards them drawing fluid from the tissues back in to the bloodstream. If protein in the blood falls too low fluid accumulates in the tissues causing edema( other serious health issues not related to protein cause edema too).Proteins are a buffer for PH (acid-base) balance regulation of body fluids.

Lastly protein can be used for energy in an emergency. Proteins are stripped of their nitrogen and burned for energy instead of being used for the vital function that we have evolved for protein to be used for. On the other side if too much protein is taken in the excess is broken down then converted to glycogen or fat and stored for future energy needs. When used for energy each gram of protein contains four calories.

So these are the basic roles of protein in the body and I hope this gives you a pretty good Idea of the importance protein and its uses in the body. Next I will try to go into how it is utilized by body and estimating protein needs correctly.

OK onward with a new chapter. The reason why the whole proteins found in animal or plant tissue must be broken down and reassembled is every individual must make his or her own unique body proteins. The disassembly process involves the breaking of cross-links that have formed with side chains of the many amino acids, after that breaking the peptide bonds between amino acids. A I mentioned in a “cooking tuna post” often the first step is cooking . Heat is a factor that changes the configuration of amino acid chains within the protein.(Remember denaturation weakens peptide links from the food post?). Acids and alcohol also can cause denaturation, thus marinating meats have a tenderizing effect, the are breaking down bonds between amino acid chains.

Its cooked and now we eat it, the digestion begins. The sight, smell and taste of food triggers the stomach to secrete enzymes and acid that start denaturization of the protein and uncoiling of its molecules. Stomach acids also help with the activation of enzymes who’s function is to cut certain peptide bonds, dividing the long chains amino's into shorter ones called polypeptides. Digestion of protein continues now in the small intestine. Alkaline juices from the pancreas neutralize stomach acids, and specialized protein splitting pantcreatic and intestinal enzymes take over to further break down the polypeptides to dipeptides and finally single amino acids, that are absorbed through the intestinal wall into the blood and transported to the liver.

Some proteins are more digestible then others, but in general 97% of animal protein is digested and absorbed and 78 to 85 for fruits, beans and vegetables, but not all the amino acids that enter the blood stream are from food. The digestive enzymes are also protein, and after they have done their job, they are broken into their component amino acids and reabsorbed to be reused as needed. On top of this protein containing cells in the lining of the intestines are constantly being shed, and some of the protein from these cells are also reabsorbed while some is excreted. The body is amazingly efficient.

The role of an amino acid upon transport to the liver is completely dependent on the body’s need at that second in time. Some of the amino’s are used for the liver’s own needs as well as many specialized proteins, lipoproteins and albumin: a blood protein. Some amino’s enter the bloodstream, joining amino’s either liberated or broken down during body tissue synthesis. As these amino’s travel throughout the body, each cell, controlled by its DNA takes from the shared amino acid pool all the needed chains to synthesize the innumerable proteins required for its specific function.

A sufficient supply of both essential and non essential amino acids are critical for protein synthesis to proceed. If a non essential amino is unavailable but needed the cell will just make it using parts from other amino acids as it assembles the protein, but if one of the essential amino’s is missing the whole train comes to a stop. The incomplete protein is disassembled and the amino’s returned to the blood for use by other cells in need of materials for their specific protein project. Amino acids can not be stored for future use, they are returned to the liver, stripped of their nitrogen, which is incorporated into the urea then sent to the kidneys for extraction, or simply put, pissed out. The remaining protein shell will be converted to glucose and used for energy or converted to fat for storage. There are other circumstances when protein synthesis does not take place, this is when the body can not obtain sufficient energy to carry on vital functions, or extreme dieting in simpler terms, in this situation the protein is used to maintain vital organs and functions. Kiss your muscles goodbye.

So I hope I have covered how the body uses protein in this segment in a understandable way. I will get to protein needs but I think we should talk protein quality next. Any feed back would be appreciated.

I guess its time to try to put another chapter on the protein thread,not many questions, so I will assume its pretty clear so far.(1Quick1) I will get to yours in details soon). So what is a good protein?

All foods except sugar or pure fat contain some protein, and every single food protein is made up of different amino acids. Obviously then some foods provide a better selection of amino’s then others. A food that contains the nine essential amino acids are generally called “complete” or high quality proteins, with the exception of gelatin, all animal proteins fall into this category. Vegetable proteins are generally referred to as lower quality or “incomplete” proteins because the are deficient in one or more amino’s,the exception being Soybeans, it is close to equal to animal protein. Lucky for vegetarians all plant foods are not short on the same amino acids, so by combining different plant foods a person can get all the essential amino acids. So two incomplete proteins that make up for each others shortfalls are called complementary proteins. Strangely enough, most ethnic cuisines feature complimenty protein dishes, an example would be Mexicans eating beans and tortilla’s or Middle Easterners eating chick peas with bulgur wheat. For those that only eat a little meat, a small amount of protein will make up for any dietary shortfalls in plant food based diet.

The body does not store amino acids as it does fats and carbohydrates. For adults having all the essential amino acids in one meal is not necessary according to the latest research, but it is for teens and in my opinion only, body builders! They need to ensure all the essential amino acids are available simultaneously for the synthesis of body proteins. The reason guys my age can get away with incomplete proteins on occasion is because not only are amino acids added to circulation(amino acid pool) from food but also from the constant turn over from body tissue breakdown and digestive enzymes, so in the short term if any amino’s are missing from diet these other sources will temporarily take care of the imbalance. A weightlifter and a growing teen does not have this luxury, the demand is much higher. Still eating a complementary protein or a complete protein later in the day will generally replenish the amino pool before shortages effect the body’s synthesis of new proteins.

Doctors and scientists use complicated tests and calculations to rate food proteins.(BV) or biological value,(PER) protein efficiency ratio (NPU) net protein utilization are all terms you might havew seen before. All the tests give different numbers and have shortcomings. These protein measuring tools are useful in the industry for comparing nutritive of different lots of a single food , or in uniform diet tests for humans but these measurements give little useful information about the protein quality of complex diets as the amino acid patterns of a mixed diet will always compliment each other to a smaller or greater degree, then would single foods alone, making the tests used virtually useless for us as body builders. They are too simple and only take a single food or blend into consideration. Another factor the tests do not take into account( think food labels) is how efficient the individuals body is in its use of dietary protein or the calories taken it with them. Still in the USA , England and Canada, to name just a few everyone exceeds their protein needs.

Last chapter will be estimating actual protein needs compared to recommended dietary allowance.

Protein has a false mystique as a super nutrient that can enhance performance and health or cause weight reduction. Many people have the misconception that if some protein is good lots is better. The average USA diet, according to a federal government survey puts protein at 16% of total caloric intake. This works out to 90 grams for men and means even those on the bottom of the socioeconomic scale are getting more then enough protein for “average” person. That said, high protein diets have never been proved as detrimental to healthy people, but the processing of excessive protein can overburden the liver or kidneys that are damaged by disease, and over consumption of protein is not totally harmless: 2/3 of the protein in our diets come from animal sources, this could possibly lead to the development of atherosclerosis and obesity.

As I talked about earlier the body can not store excessive protein, except as amino acids in all tissues, extra protein just adds calories to the diet, so eating a high protein diet is often just like over eating. The myths surrounding protein have lead many people to over consume in the belief it will foster the development of muscle faster by taking massive amounts. Not true. Still we body builders do need more then what is recommended by the RDA, but these needs can be met through a good whole diet. In some cases a high protein diet can work against an athlete. It increases the risk of dehydration as more water is need to clear the by-products of protein metabolism and can make it difficult to eat enough carbs to ensure stores of glycogen for the muscles and liver.

Sounds like I am coming down pretty hard on protein? I am not but there is so much hype that it makes the truth seem negative. I guess while I am at it I will touch on these high protein low carb diets and the dangers of them.

The main fuel for the central nervous system is glucose, this is most easily obtained from carbs, then protein and finally fats. When you limit your carb intake, like when fasting or on a high protein/low carb diet, protein is used to supply the needed glucose. This protein will come from the diet if available, if not from organs and lean body tissue. The body can break down tissue for about 4 weeks before death, so if carbs are not available for several days the body starts conserving essential protein by creating another energy source through the burning of fatty acids. These ketone's work as a glucose substitute fueling most of the nervous systems cells. As the breakdown of fat continues ketone's build up in the blood causing ketosis. Ketogenic diets are popular because they cause large amounts of weight loss in the first weeks, however the initial weight loss is not fat but water caused by the kidneys effort to ride the body of excessive ketone's and protein by products. Ketogenic diets make the blood more acidic, causing headaches, fatigue and nausea along with some potentially serious ones such as cardiovascular diseases, cancers, renal disease and bowel disorders. No one should go below 1200 cal for men or 1000 for women in any non physician controlled diet.

OK I got a bit off topic here, and I still want to cover amino acids supplements and protein needs for us body builders, so 1 or 2 more chapters still. I do not want anyone to be taking a negative view towards protein as you read this essay, I am just showing the science of protein, the biochemical values and function. We do over supplement generally speaking, but I do feel some protein supplementation is needed for us body builders and hope to get to that soon.

OK a sub-text on Amino Acids and conclusion on protein.I am going to start with a very strong statement.

Amino acids supplements are a waste of money, unless you have a genetic disorder or perhaps in the tragic case of a burn victim. WE receive more then enough through food. Money wise it just makes sense, grill apiece of chicken and open a can of tuna or pay triple that for a Amino acid supplement that only covers one amino and in a dose big enough to take it out of the realm of supplement into the realm of drug.

Amino acid supplementation, according to more the a dozen of my medical sources, is a potentially dangerous fad promoted through health food stores and magazines. There is no need for these products in healthy individuals. Most of the claims are exaggerated misrepresention of good research over the last 10 or 15 years. There is little to no research suggesting that amino acid supplements offer any benefits to non-nutritional disorders. Excessive doses can have serious side effects. I used to use L-tryptophan for stress, but it was taken off the market due to more then 1000 cases of eosinophilia myalgia ( a muscle disorder) in the 90’s at that point there had been 20 deaths directly related to non prescription tryptophan. I had no side effects.

Single amino acids supps can interfere with the absorption food derived amino's. What happens is groups of amino’s that would normally be transported across the intestinal wall get displaced by the flood of a amino supplement which can lead to other amino's not being absorbed in the correct amounts to meet the body’s needs. The FDA actually removed Amino’s from the agency’s GRAS list in 1974.( generally recognized as safe). There is a place for amino supplementation. It is for medical disorders and some cancers. Not nutrition. Back to protien now, in its whole form.

The protein needs weightlifters trying to increase their muscle mass range from 1.4 to 1.8 grams of protein per kilogram of body weight. These increased needs are easily met through traditional food sources. But a good quality whey protein is not a bad idea, in my personal opinion.

I would like to QUOTE a part of a paper by Josephine Conolly-Schoonen, MS, RD ... She holds a faculty position in the Department of Family Medicine in the School of Medicine at the State University of New York-Stony Brook and has extensive experience as a national spokeswoman for the American Dietetic Association.

“Protein supplements consist of either whole protein, such as egg, milk or soy protein, or individual amino acids or combinations of individual amino acids. Whole protein supplements do not offer an advantage over food sources of protein, but may offer convenience. Powders tend to be more concentrated protein sources than pills. Energy bars are most convenient and can offer a significant amount of protein. Readily available instant breakfast powder mixes offer a cheaper alternative to specially marketed protein powders. Athletes should be cautioned against very concentrated whole protein supplements that may displace carbohydrate in the diet or exceed protein needs.
Individual amino acid supplements of branch-chain amino acids (leucine, isoleucine and valine), as well as arginine, lysine or glutamine have been theorized to enhance exercise performance. However, studies examining their effect on performance have not consistently supported these theories. Most single or combination amino acid pills offer very small amounts of the amino acids. Consumers should be aware that the amount of amino acids is indicated on food labels as milligrams. Since protein content on food labels is indicated in grams, the amount of amino acids seems inflated.
Most athletes are meeting or exceeding their protein requirements through diet. There are, however, some athletes at risk for inadequate protein. These individuals are typically restricting caloric intake in order to achieve a low body weight and generally include wrestlers, gymnasts, dancers, and runners.[1,5] Inadequate protein intake increases an athlete's risk for injury and chronic fatigue.
Research does not support protein intake in excess of 2.0 grams per kilogram body weight. Excess protein intake is associated with dehydration, and may be related to excessive urinary calcium losses and inadequate carbohydrate intake. Theoretically, an impairment of kidney function has been associated with excessive protein intake. However, this has not been empirically demonstrated in the literature. Dehydrated athletes are more likely to be affected.”

I find what she is stating is pretty much the consensus in the medical/ biology field, but not necessarily the weightlifting opinion. Personally I feel we in the medical field have a slightly better grounding in the science of nutrition, and I will never go above 2 grams/ KG of body mass.

Well that concludes my first article for EB I hope you have enjoyed it and perhaps learned or at least opened your mind to a few new idea’s on protein supplementation. I will be happy to answer questions, and I am hopeful other members too will respond with their opinions to any questions.

Thanks for reading,
Stephen

Hmm we are moving into carbs now...

Why are you wanting to spike your insulin? Do you think it will push food into the muscles? That is too narrow of a approach, you have to look at the bigger picture. I would go for steady over a spike any-day. The endocrine system is quite capable of deciding how much insulin needs to be released, and given a good and constant diet the building blocks for that are in place. You can artificially spike it with simple carbs, but it puts other systems into a unbalance.

The drink will do no harm, but if your diet is good a high protein and medium high carb meal in the first hour after the workout is fine in my opinion, stay away form the fat on this one. I see where you are going with this, and all that new age hype is just that hype. You do not need a protein drink and a bunch of dextrose or maltodextrin right after a workout, your body has good stores of protein with a good diet. It is that simple to me. Your body will not go into starvation mode from a workout and start tearing down muscle! The human body is a pretty well designed machine, with a good diet, it can do great things.

Any post work out needs will vary by individual and effort.

You seem to have a pretty good handle on what the world of body building thinks one should do after a workout, I can follow their reasoning but it is too narrow and only looks at one aspect...building muscle based on incomplete science, they are picking out the bits from good research papers and using only what suites them, so alot of the information out there on the Net is being taken out of context. It is generally done to help sell supplements.
BiggerThnU is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2006, 05:03 PM   Protein.... form and function Post #2
Bodybuilder
 
punksurfer024's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 497
Rep Power: 778
punksurfer024 has a reputation beyond reputepunksurfer024 has a reputation beyond reputepunksurfer024 has a reputation beyond reputepunksurfer024 has a reputation beyond reputepunksurfer024 has a reputation beyond reputepunksurfer024 has a reputation beyond reputepunksurfer024 has a reputation beyond reputepunksurfer024 has a reputation beyond reputepunksurfer024 has a reputation beyond reputepunksurfer024 has a reputation beyond reputepunksurfer024 has a reputation beyond repute
great post so far!!!
punksurfer024 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-01-2006, 05:10 PM   Protein.... form and function Post #3
Gym Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Age: 18
Posts: 1,330
Rep Power: 1951
JellyBeans has a reputation beyond reputeJellyBeans has a reputation beyond reputeJellyBeans has a reputation beyond reputeJellyBeans has a reputation beyond reputeJellyBeans has a reputation beyond reputeJellyBeans has a reputation beyond reputeJellyBeans has a reputation beyond reputeJellyBeans has a reputation beyond reputeJellyBeans has a reputation beyond reputeJellyBeans has a reputation beyond reputeJellyBeans has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to JellyBeans Send a message via MSN to JellyBeans Send a message via Yahoo to JellyBeans
Yeah, excellent post! I can't wait for the other parts. Reps :cool:
JellyBeans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2006, 12:35 AM   Protein.... form and function Post #4
Admin getting yoked
 
1quick1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ohio
Posts: 7,994
Height: 5'10''
Weight: 183lbs.
Rep Power: 107397
1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to 1quick1 Send a message via Yahoo to 1quick1
Very interesting article. However, I don't exactly believe in the 10-15% of total calories calculation. The RDA sets these numbers for the average couch warmer with 16% BF and hardly any muscle mass. However, I'm sure you'll get into that in greater detail in your next post.
1quick1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-04-2006, 02:08 AM   Protein.... form and function Post #5
 
BiggerThnU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Planet Earth,Western hemisphere
Age: 44
Posts: 180
Rep Power: 932
BiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1quick1 View Post
Very interesting article. However, I don't exactly believe in the 10-15% of total calories calculation. The RDA sets these numbers for the average couch warmer with 16% BF and hardly any muscle mass. However, I'm sure you'll get into that in greater detail in your next post.
Very valid thought, and completely in tune with todays thinking, I hope I can answer it succinctly and convince you to save your money on the expensive "amino acids" in my next two protein topics.

The rule of thumb if I recall correctly is over a gram per pound of body wieght..not lean muscle mass. Both ways are too high to me for protein intake (remember you do not just pee excess protein away as is commonly believed) and they hit hard in the wallet..but I will get to this in my next day off.

Good to know someone is still reading this stuff!

Last edited by BiggerThnU; 11-04-2006 at 10:31 AM.
BiggerThnU is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-09-2006, 10:18 PM   Protein.... form and function Post #6
Admin getting yoked
 
1quick1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ohio
Posts: 7,994
Height: 5'10''
Weight: 183lbs.
Rep Power: 107397
1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to 1quick1 Send a message via Yahoo to 1quick1
Wow, big I'm glad that you had that backed up.
1quick1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-10-2006, 01:11 AM   Protein.... form and function Post #7
Admin getting yoked
 
1quick1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ohio
Posts: 7,994
Height: 5'10''
Weight: 183lbs.
Rep Power: 107397
1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to 1quick1 Send a message via Yahoo to 1quick1
just in case i had backed it up on my comp right before everything happen
1quick1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-12-2006, 09:50 PM   Protein.... form and function Post #8
Admin getting yoked
 
1quick1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ohio
Posts: 7,994
Height: 5'10''
Weight: 183lbs.
Rep Power: 107397
1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to 1quick1 Send a message via Yahoo to 1quick1
Yea I've always heard the animal proteins are better then plant proteins like peanut butter. I'm looking forward to the next installment.
1quick1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2006, 08:10 PM   Protein.... form and function Post #9
Muscular
 
BODYBUILDER889's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: In the darkest corner of the gym where few men dare to tread...
Posts: 121
Rep Power: 16
BODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond repute
Excellent read. I dont totally agree but well researched nonetheless
BODYBUILDER889 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2006, 09:48 PM   Protein.... form and function Post #10
Admin getting yoked
 
1quick1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Ohio
Posts: 7,994
Height: 5'10''
Weight: 183lbs.
Rep Power: 107397
1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute1quick1 has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to 1quick1 Send a message via Yahoo to 1quick1
Good post biggerThnU.

I stick to 1 - 1.5 grams of protein per day.

I agree with these stuff about keto. When I did my first and only cut I hated it. Felt tired, grumpy, headaches, cravings ALL the time. This was taking in 2300-2400 calories daily, all clean foods. Now that I'm bulking I'm happy, feel energized, and hardly ever get cravings for junk food.
1quick1 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 11-15-2006, 10:38 PM   Protein.... form and function Post #11
 
BiggerThnU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Planet Earth,Western hemisphere
Age: 44
Posts: 180
Rep Power: 932
BiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond repute
Thanks for the feed back gents, I have tried to stick to science facts rather then modern hypothesis just for a different angle to approach protein from. For the record I am not against 1.5 to 2 grams per lean pound of body weight for people who do monster work outs regularly. It is overkill, but better too much protein then not enough for body builders, we are a exception. Questions are welcome and where I have stated a opinion rather then fact,so are differences, lets hear why more is better. I think when people say I use 1gram or 2 grams per pound of body weight they are being a bit narrow,whats the point if the cals and carbs are not there too? Balance is key. Keep protein below 20% of total caloric intake.

Endocrinology and Chemical Biology are a part of my on going education, but also a fun hobby.

Boy are you guys going to hate me when I tell you the science(what little I know) , not the hype behind taking amino acids!
BiggerThnU is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2006, 08:12 AM   Protein.... form and function Post #12
Muscular
 
BODYBUILDER889's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: In the darkest corner of the gym where few men dare to tread...
Posts: 121
Rep Power: 16
BODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond reputeBODYBUILDER889 has a reputation beyond repute
What about caloric expenditure ( :idk: ) from the body burning protein? Mark Dugdale seems to be of the opinion that when the body utilizes proteins it burns off OTHER calories. I would love to agree with him but I'm not sure of it. Something about the heat produced from protein breakdown causes other calories ( fats,carbs etc.) to break down as well.
Theory anyone?
BODYBUILDER889 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-16-2006, 10:18 AM   Protein.... form and function Post #13
 
BiggerThnU's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Planet Earth,Western hemisphere
Age: 44
Posts: 180
Rep Power: 932
BiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond reputeBiggerThnU has a reputation beyond repute
Quote:
Originally Posted by BODYBUILDER889 View Post
What about caloric expenditure ( :idk: ) from the body burning protein? Mark Dugdale seems to be of the opinion that when the body utilizes proteins it burns off OTHER calories. I would love to agree with him but I'm not sure of it. Something about the heat produced from protein breakdown causes other calories ( fats,carbs etc.) to break down as well.
Theory anyone?
It is a complex process, but I can give a simple answer. In the sense of a Calorie referring to the amount of energy it takes to heat one gram of water by one degree celsius.. As a unit of energy, then yes. A calorie contains 4.186 kilojoules. Anything the body does burns calories, it is where the calories come from that is more important, As far as the body is concerned the best source would be carbs. Our bodies can not do a single thing without burning calories. It is simply a part of your metabolism.

The heat produced from protein synthesis IS what we would measure to determine the calories burned,but it does not cause other calories (here I think you mean glucose)to break down.

reading this back to myself, I am not sure if I got my point across, did this answer your question BODYBUILDER889?
BiggerThnU is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2006, 08:35 PM   Protein.... form and function Post #14
Bodybuilder
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Posts: 658
Rep Power: 1650
Newfiechick has a reputation beyond reputeNewfiechick has a reputation beyond reputeNewfiechick has a reputation beyond reputeNewfiechick has a reputation beyond reputeNewfiechick has a reputation beyond reputeNewfiechick has a reputation beyond reputeNewfiechick has a reputation beyond reputeNewfiechick has a reputation beyond reputeNewfiechick has a reputation beyond reputeNewfiechick has a reputation beyond reputeNewfiechick has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via MSN to Newfiechick
Wow Bigger! Great info here. Thanks for posting
Newfiechick is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

  BodyBuilding > The Supplement Area > Supplements

Go Back   BodyBuilding > The Supplement Area > Supplements

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes


LinkBacks (?)
LinkBack to this Thread: http://bodybuilding.fitness.com/supplements/831-protein-form-function.html
Posted By For Type Date
Graphing Calculator - best calculator, graphing calculator perkins This thread Refback 11-15-2007 08:22 AM
Iron Factor :: Zobrazit téma - Poradte mi ake proteiny kupit This thread Refback 01-29-2007 05:03 PM
excessive protien intake dangerous? (reps for answers exper. bodybuilders only plz) - Bodybuilding.com Forums This thread Refback 01-27-2007 03:30 AM
excessive protien intake dangerous? (reps for answers exper. bodybuilders only plz) - Bodybuilding.com Forums This thread Refback 01-27-2007 12:32 AM
MILK - Good or bad? This thread Trackback 01-12-2007 06:42 PM
Iron Factor :: Zobrazit téma - Poradte mi ake proteiny kupit This thread Refback 12-18-2006 02:05 AM
Any good articles on protein consumption? - Bodybuilding.com Forums This thread Refback 12-17-2006 03:16 AM
Any good articles on protein consumption? - Bodybuilding.com Forums This thread Refback 12-15-2006 10:06 PM

Similar threads to Protein.... form and function
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How is this form?
How is this form?: Is mback back rounding? The color match with the...
oval61251 Member Pictures and Videos 4 03-04-2009 10:34 PM
Gemma Protein (LG Lipotropic) VS. Whey Protein Chart
Gemma Protein (LG Lipotropic) VS. Whey Protein Chart: http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p116/Critical_M...
Critical Mass Supplements 1 11-04-2008 10:14 PM
Is whey protein better than just eating high protein foods daily?
Is whey protein better than just eating high protein foods daily?: Even though whey protein is the best kind, you...
HealthyLiving8 Supplements 5 10-11-2008 05:25 PM
A new protein coming to town...... Lipotropic Protein!!
A new protein coming to town...... Lipotropic Protein!!: http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p116/Critical_M...
Critical Mass Supplements 6 08-30-2008 07:34 PM
Is my form right?
Is my form right?: YouTube - Can't Bench :lolabove: NO...
oval61251 Exercises 13 02-28-2008 06:50 PM

More threads of BiggerThnU
Thread Date Forum Replies Last Post
Protein.... form and function
Protein.... form and function: As threatened the science side of protein. I...
11-01-2006 Supplements 26 04-03-2008 08:21 PM
Bulking?
Bulking?: A general question...when you all say "bulking"...
10-26-2006 Bodybuilding News and Information 7 11-01-2006 06:06 AM

Other threads in forum Supplements
Thread Date Thread Starter Replies Last Post
H-Drol
H-Drol: I am in my third week of H-Drol and I got to say...
01-07-2009 Malley 25 03-10-2009 09:11 AM
Expired Creatine
Expired Creatine: I got some expired creatine from a buddy who...
01-28-2009 ecmwrestler 6 02-02-2009 09:09 PM
Iso-Leucine by Supplement Direct
Iso-Leucine by Supplement Direct: Iso-Leucine by Supplement Direct ...
07-27-2008 REPS 0 07-27-2008 04:44 PM
Before and after Methyl 1 - D
Before and after Methyl 1 - D: Here is a great testimonial for LG Sciences...
06-30-2008 Critical Mass 0 06-30-2008 06:22 PM
NO-Infuse, “Shirt Busting Pumps”!
NO-Infuse, “Shirt Busting Pumps”!: http://i126.photobucket.com/albums/p116/Critical_M...
06-26-2008 Critical Mass 0 06-26-2008 04:14 PM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:44 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.2.0
© 2006-2008 Fitness.com All Rights Reserved.

| fitness.com | Fitness Training | Weight Loss | Sports | Friend Codes |

You are viewing Protein.... form and function.